Cries of the Infidels
Created on: September 20th, 2006
For more stories (or if you were too lazy to sit through my YTMND) go here: http://www.cuttingedge.org/shaw/index.html For those who deny the Voltaire/Geneva Bible Society story, go here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferney
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I watched the whole thing. It was well made, aesthetically. There was a page in infidel 4 that
went by too quickly. However, I personally disagree with the usage of the word "infidel", as it
is most currently used in the context of islamic extremism, and religious extremism in general.
Whats more, all we have here is anecdotal evidence that could very plausibly be people
second-guessing their athiesm and panicking on their death bed, surely a imaginable situation.
All too often the evangelical ytmnders take on a negative tone, simply discrediting the other
side. Always with the 'sinners in the hands of an angry god' rhetoric, which this page
typifies. Never is a word spoke about the good aspects of christianity, what it has done for
people, how it can help.
Whetstone, for someone spouting "infidel" on a daily basis, you certainly break your religion a hell of a lot. Nearly everything you ever say on this website is a class A example of pride, thinking yourself better than the "unwashed, unsaved masses". Your icon, a cross with your name on it, almost suggesting you believe you ARE the christian religion, is a class A example of this.
Not to mention, if "god" actually were doing these kinds of things to people, wouldn't that be a wrath, a sin? Isn't god supposed to be flawless according to your beliefs? Another thing, in the story of job, the god you so heavily preach gambles with the devil. Isn't gambling a sin? Is his inability to solve the worlds suffering not sloth, yet another sin? There are reasons people don't share carbon copies of your beliefs, whetstone, so please, for the sake of the world, stop preaching with such fervor
There are some interesting stories, but there's nothing here that would be considered unusual or unexpected. If people are told throughout their lives that "X will happen if you don't Y", then they will fear that X will happen when they don't Y, regardless of their own experiences or spiritual precendence.
While I disagree with your religious viewpoint, the Sh*tty Slideshow YTMND (Smoothmedia's own term, meant in an endearing manner like "f*ggy short film" nowadays) is pretty well done, with the exception of the creppy music. I hold true to my promise, and will 5 this, however. (wonderers can see Whetstone's Starfox Chick YTMND).
"There are some interesting stories, but there's nothing here that would be considered unusual or unexpected. If people are told throughout their lives that "X will happen if you don't Y", then they will fear that X will happen when they don't Y, regardless of their own experiences or spiritual precendence."
I agree. If you really wanted me to believe this, collect similar testimonies from people that grew up lacking the Catholic background.
Anyway 3'd for being fairly well made but poor content and overuse of "infidel". Some of the screens went too fast.
I can't stomach another one of these irrational argument acompanied with music pages. It's really offensive(although more than allowable) for you idiots to assert you have some perception of the universe I lack that allows you to dictate my fundmental beleives. Your appeals to majority are really inappropriate for the indeterminate. I seriously ask that if anyone beleives I have taken offense unreasonably, to contact me by PM.
Please. Until then, stop insulting my ability to decide for myself.
This site fails to make a case. Saying that numerous people have seen similar visions even though they never met warrants trueth is flawed, since they almost certainly heard of similar accounts of hell from multiple sources. Would have 2'd it because this shows you put some thought into this, but wasn't funny, so 1'd.
Thousands of people report being abducted by aliens every year and most have similar stories, but I highly doubt you would find this as compelling evidence to the existance of extraterrestrial life. Furthermore, all of these "infidels" were westerners. Find an "infidel" outside of the influence of western culture say the same at death and maybe I would see an argument. 1
I challange anyone who mentioned it in the comments to find an unbiased source on deathbed ravings. Only Christian clergy and friends of the deceased seem to have the wherewithal to hold out through such a frightening ordeal. I'll tell you what though, there is nothing more painful to attend than the death of an unsaved person. My dad has been to dozens of those funerals and he feels completely drained spiritually, physically, and emotionally. And no, my dad ain't no pastor. He's a Commander (Ret.) in the US Navy, and he's seen plenty of good men die.
The introduction, terminology, and hypocrisy make this a winner. Skepticism is "an attitude of doubt or a disposition to incredulity either in general or toward a particular object", so to say that they are certain would mean that they were not skeptics. To say that, dying men either delerious from old age or in delerium from great pain (or the old-school remedies that people cooked up in the times before modern medicine) are not exactly the most trustworthy witnesses, and of course testimony is neither scientifically admissible or even considered. Calling everyone an infidel is laughable, honestly, and it ruins any integrity this piece might ever wish to have.
Infidel typically has a HIGHLY negative connotation, so by calling these people infidels you are actually discrediting their own stories. Personally, you can call me an infidel all you'd like because in the place of "man of faith" or "men of faith" I use the word "sheep". It's not a coincidence that the singular and the plural are one and the same, as it kills the self. Nietzsche would love to have a go at you. ikanreed makes some good points, as well, and we can now see that your apologetic tactics were, as we all knew, thinly veiled evangelism. Evangelism is not welcome outside of the bible belt, and the bible belt is about as welcome as slavery. Oh, and the bible belt was responsible for that, by the way.
Remade it huh? Still full of false quotes and made up conversion tales. F*ck your little church group sponsorship circle so you get. Thanks for calling us infidels, it only highlights that we are the oppressed. If you had done any research on Voltaire, you would see you are prooving his points on the evils of religion.
I wonder if any Hindu or Buddhist "infidel" has experianced such a death. Have past Dalai Lamas experianced visions of demons from hell prior to death due to their lack of faith in Christ, or have they gone confidently holding faith in their non-Christian form of "release". Perhaps such visions only are found in atheists under the influence of a Christian culture. You must remember that atheists of the western world are not the only "non-christians".
Frankly this reeks bias. When hypocrites such as whetstone decide that to be "thrown into the burning pit" means a fire and brimstone Hell they are mistaken. Gehenna (aka the burning pits) were areas outside the city walls of Roman occupied Arabia where garbage was burned. These pits were also used to burn the bodies of those not deserving a proper burial (Murderers, Rapists, False Prophets, etc.) Because the Jewish people belived that when a body died the soul went to Sheol (not an afterlife more like a sleep than actual death) where it would wait until the last days when it would be reunited with the undamaged body and ressurected by G-D. Burning a body would deny an afterlife at all and would be the worst fate imaginable. Gehena is not Hell.
You know, part of me is genuinely fascinated by whetstone for no other reason than being a religious fanatic of a most unusual order. While mainstream Christianity has evolved from the hellfire and brimstone sermons of the reformation to the peachy-keen pep rallies of modern church stadiums, whetsone harkens back to a very sinister and gothic disposition that was the mainstay of Catholicism during the middle ages. Hell, if you want to get really sullen about the whole Christ situation, read up on of the founders of Calvinist theology who believed salvation was predetermined and human will to be nonexistent.
It’s actually a far more logical doctrine than the tenuous theology of those feel-good evangelicals, but as a religious product it’s far less marketable and quite a bit of a downer if you end up on the wrong side of God’s cosmic coinflip. Anyway, as much as I admire whetsone’s aesthetic prowess, the “arguments” presented here aren’t even at a high school debate team level. We should follow Jesus because a handful of dying men had obscure visions and desperate fixations on atoning for their sins? Were death not a fundamental fear, an emotion that drives men to careless and illogical behavior, there might be the foundation of an argument here somewhere.
However, if you’re saying that we should carelessly abandon thousands of years of scholarly, philosophical progress for nothing more than a blind promise that any street corner bum could offer, then be honest and forthright about it. You want us to think like children. You want us to cower and tremble in fear of our terrible Godparent, the same one who, by logical inference, created every evil and affliction that inhabits this world. That is, unless you were speaking of Gnosticism and the blind god Samael, but you don’t strike me as that well-informed.
My churchly upbringing allows me to recall 1 Corinthians 13:11: “When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.” When I was I child I was afraid of the dark. Now, as a man, I understand than fear is nothing but ignorance. We fear what we do not understand. When I was a child I also feared God. Now, as an enlightened man, I fear nothing...
Since you resubmitted this, I guess I have to re-comment. "Personal Pics=no" Hey, biblethumper, get the f*ck off ytmnd you f*cking c*ntbag- how many times do you have to be told? Even max told you to get the f*ck out with your religious sh*t. You're a dumb sh*t, you know that? Stop cramming sh*t down peoples' throats. Yeah, you put a disclaimer before your f*ggy slideshow. You really think that's going to stop people from looking at it? No, you don't, do you. You're edging it off for all the curious to plunge off of a 7-minute long cliff. F*ck you churchie.
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,
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In the end, you are nothing but a bigot who cannot understand that non-believers are decent people that live and die as happily as anyone else.
That people convert to Christianity proves nothing: people also deconvert FROM Christianity. So what? And the Voltaire story is well known... and bogus. But if you can't convert in life, you can just lie about it, no?
I had a severe allergic reaction to the point where my throat at swollen up and I couldn't breathe, I suffucated and was dead for a good 30 seconds (according to my mother) before I was revived by the paramedics.
I saw nothing... It seemed to me as if I had just closed my eyes and opened them again...
Proof enough to me that there is no afterlife, I'm not going to waste my time, money, or life following something I know isn't true.
SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!! SCREAMER!!!
Do any Muslims, Jews, Buhddists, or Hindus cry for Jesus before expiration? The more people that do this beofre death weakens your case, not strengthen. It just shows this is a common psychological panic in death. I like Muslim extremeists because they're way over THERE, whereas the christian extremists are way over HERE.
Go away. I don't care.
Agnostic. Died of a massive heart attack. Came back on the table. GUESS WHAT HAPPENED. NOTHING. Actually, I got to go to a Flaming Lips concert for eternity. Either Wayne Coyne is God, or you are full of crap. This is no joke, it's what happened. Anyway, 1 for religious debate, it does not belong here. And also, THIS IS SLOW AS F*CK.
This was interesting, so I won't subtract any points, even though it is somewhat disrespectful religious propaganda. But here is what I find really interesting: If I were to assume these accounts were both accurate and representative of how the real world works, then it doesn't reflect too positively on God. I mean, many "infidels" are capable of being very good people: a persons religion seems to be relatively unrelated to how kind or altruistic a person is. If God really punishes people not for their deeds, but for their abstract beleifs, he certainly meets my definition of "Evil," and it is likely that he could even be called a sociopath. So I hope for everyone's sake you are wrong whetstone, but as I said, it isn't a bad ytmnd.
i dont go to any church and i believe in scientific authority, but it was strangely odd when I was writing a story in which the character (fictional me) recieves something exactly at 11:33 PM, and after a few hours and going to the bathroom, coming back I saw that it was exactly 11:33 PM. proof that god exists, i should make a ytmnd. whether god was smiling or frowning down on me i can't tell but it was a cool feeling. Whether God actually exists or not, it makes one feel better inside to believe that he is there God, even when you don't follow him.
So, according to this, anyone who is not a christian dies in horrible fright and pain. Which is bullsh*t, since I've unfortunately seen several "infidels" die without meds or morphine nad none of them thought they were burning and going to hell. I wish you people would stop pushing your agenda on us.
Nice and well made, good research. I understand that internet aetheist may accept the term infidel, but I still think a better word could have been used. I agree with other people who have posted comments. Hellfire and damnation is nothing fun perhaps a ytmnd showing the good things Jesus/Christianity have done for people would be better?
As a philosopher I feel compelled to defend Voltaire. Upon a little more research it seems your account of his death is an old lie half propagated by priests and half by Abbe Barruel. The actual account of his death is given by Wagniere, his Secretary:
"He expired about a quarter past eleven at night, with the most perfect tranquility, after having suffered the cruelest pains in consequence of those fatal drugs, which his own imprudence, and especially that of the persons who should have looked to it, made him swallow. Ten minutes before his last breath he took the hand of Morand, his valet-de-chambre, who was, watching him; pressed it, and said, 'Adieu, mon cher Morand, je me meurs -- Adieu, my dear Morand, I am gone.'
These are the last words uttered by M. de Voltaire."
[Carlyle, Vol. II., p. 160.]
He made no recantation and indeed refused the oppertunity several times refusing it last to the Cure of St. Sulpice who asked if he acknowledged the divinity of "our Lord Jesus Christ" Voltaire responded by pushing one of his hands against the Cure's calotte (coif), shoving him back, and crying out while turning abruptly to the other side, "let me die in peace (Laissez-moi mourir en paix)."
It is further made evident that Voltaire made no recantation in the fact that the Bishop of Troyes sent a peremptory dispatch to the Prior of Scellieres, which lay in his diocese, forbidding him to inter the "heritics's" remains.
Obviously there is dispute from the infidel camp about the death of Voltaire- and I knew this when creating this YTMND. The problem is that even the atheist websites do not agree on the details of Voltaire's death- causing me to question their reliability. They attribute the details in this story as 'rumors' and so on. When we come down to it, however- we find that a lot of rumor is founded upon truth, and a good many clergy and townfolk of that time were convinced well enough that these details I have given you are true. Decide what you want.
"Obviously there is dispute from the infidel camp" No, the textual accounts are clear and no biography I possess mentions your slander as more than slander. It is possible that his secretary lied for him but he had no motivation whilst many religious people had motivation to slander the popular writer Voltaire (and steal his remains some years later dumping them elsewhere). If you would like to change the title of the work to "The *Possible* Cries of the Infidels" you may, but it surly blunts your impact. Whatever the case, it is evident that Voltaire made no recantation, at least no acceptable recantation.
"Voltaire is reputed to have proclaimed about the bible, "In 100 years this book will be forgotten and eliminated...", although there is no direct evidence that he made such a statement. In his later years (1759) Voltaire purchased an estate called "Ferney" near the French-Swiss border. There is an apocryphal story that this house was purchased by the Geneva Bible Society and used for printing bibles, but this appears to be due to a misunderstanding of the 1849 annual report of the American Bible Society [1]. Voltaire's chateau is now owned and administered by the French Ministry of Culture." YOU SIT ON A THRONE OF LIES.
"I challange anyone who mentioned it in the comments to find an unbiased
source on deathbed ravings. Only Christian clergy and friends of the
deceased seem to have the wherewithal to hold out through such a
frightening ordeal." There are, more than likely, no objective sources. Thanks for proving our point. Christian sources are no better. Also, I'd like to see you prove that second statement with some facts. Without facts, you're just spinning your wheels. Nothing new for your crowd. I think that all religious experiences occur in the brain. I think that God is a product of the brain and not the other way around. This can be and has been proven. You lose good day sir.
"For those who continue to have a problem with the term 'infidel' please
visit http://www.infidels.org/ and see that internet atheists/secularists
accept the title." Atheists and secularists are people, not an organization. I would accept the term to spite evangelicals but never on its own because of its highly negative connotation. There are many Christians who have come to believe that there is no god. Does that mean that Christians believe that there is no god? Get a clue.
"Whether God
actually exists or not, it makes one feel better inside to believe that he
is there God, even when you don't follow him." People need to learn to speak from personal experience personally and not for everyone else. I believe that if there is a god then we are all just sheep and god is responisble for everything we say and do. If there is no god, we still might not be able to break determinism, but at least we are being directly determined by that which we see. I'd much rather be pused by the man at my back than the man behind the curtain. I've seen Wizard of Oz.
"The problem is that
even the atheist websites do not agree on the details of Voltaire's death-
causing me to question their reliability. They attribute the details in
this story as 'rumors' and so on. When we come down to it, however- we find
that a lot of rumor is founded upon truth, and a good many clergy and
townfolk of that time were convinced well enough that these details I have
given you are true. Decide what you want." Agreement on details is uncorrelated to truth. Atheist websites are not created equal, atheists are not created equal, atheists have nothing to do with one another. Atheists do not follow any one given creed. Atheism is not a belief structure, it is merely the absence of one. Quit being a complete idiot.
Atheist sites are not expected to give correct information as they have an agenda and do not have any sort of journalistic integrity, JUST LIKE CHRISTIAN SITES. Unbiased sites will give you unbiased information, and if the accounts given are unreliable, then the accounts from the given time are probably unreliable. Hence, all of your accounts are probably unreliable. However, iwpoe seems to find precise details of the incident from the only man in a position to actually do anything- the man who he trusted at his side when he died. You lose in so many facets it is unbelievable. I would say go to some other country with you evangelicalism, but, like Nietzsche and Voltaire said, their world (Europe) doesn't want you anymore. God is dead.
"The infidel camp" is not an existent camp, as you proved. You went to several "infidel camps" that are not the same "infidel camp" and cross referenced their material and found that each "infidel camp" was different from the other. This would imply that each "infidel camp" was separate from the others and that callin all "infidels" the "infidel camp" is obviously a terrible use of language. Just like calling all people who are not Christians "infidels" is a terrible use of language.
"When we come down to it, however- we find
that a lot of rumor is founded upon truth, and a good many clergy and
townfolk of that time were convinced well enough that these details I have
given you are true. Decide what you want." A good many clergy and townsfolk of any given time period are easily convinced by anything if they are poorly educated enough. A good deal of the time rumors may be founded on truth, but that has no bearing on whether or not this rumor was founded on truth, and it appears that it was not. Even if the biographical accounts are not founded on truth, it has no bearing on whether or not this obviously fabricated account is true. Please go to college, get an education, study logic, some philosophy, and read up on the word unbiased.
From a brother in Christ: You're not going to convert people by calling them infidels and scaring them with Hell, especially without any actual proof. For all intents and purposes any of these dying people could have merely realized how close they are to death, had second thoughts about the afterlife, and decided to convert just to be sure. Please keep your judgement in check. The only people who deserve to be treated in this manner by Christians are Christians themselves. Never once did Jesus blast a sinner for what he did, just loved them, and when the time was right encouraged them to turn away from sin. But he let the religious Pharisees have it. So the next time you decide to evangelize, please remember to love your neighbor as yourself.
There are probrably more accounts of seeing UFOs than there are of this phenomenon you speak of...and they aren't real. Plus, I don't really get the point of this since there are millions of other people who die without this great experience. Wouldn't all people be subject to it? Or are they just the good ones?
Let's face it: the Christian god is an *ssh*l*e. He's like a father that's never home, but still expects his little brats to call him "daddy" (even though they never see him) and promises to overwhelm their lives-past-childhood with misery and pain and suffering if they don't. I've met more mature 7-year-olds than that old bearded bastard. The Bible: NOW AVAILABLE IN DOUBLE-PLY!!
Ulmassir, read Dante's "Inferno" to have better insight into that. In short, your bias of pleasure = good, pain = bad is what confuses you. Pain and pleasure are in this case are both signs of god's mercy and love from a biblical stand point if they are just. Punishment in hell is a result of human action, something that god dishes out justly to each person. If he were to grant infinte pleasure to those who are evil on earth, it would be unjust and thus contradict the universal truths of the universe. Love and mercy then become subjecting one to the truths of the universe absolutely. Make sense?
My perspective. Believe in Jesus, obtain salvation.
Don't believe in Jesus, don't obtain salvation.
Your perspective. Believing in Jesus is childish, not real, or uninteluctual because there is no proof by your standards.
Not believing in Jesus, you believe there is nothingness after death or whatever.
Simply put, If I'm right, I'll be ok, and you will burn.
If you are right, nothing happens to both of us.
Why go out on a limb for nothingness? Jesus offers a free gift, just take it. :D
well its certainly interesting. but again, I have to chock this up to insanity or demensia before death. I also tend to agree with the statement that hell is what you make of it, therefore to many people earth and life may be hell. the fire's and whatnot could also be an image conjured up by the body's systems shutting down.
I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, I hate you, And, o ya, I HATE YOU.
"My perspective. Believe in Jesus, obtain salvation. Don't believe in
Jesus, don't obtain salvation. Your perspective. Believing in Jesus is
childish, not real, or uninteluctual because there is no proof by your
standards. Not believing in Jesus, you believe there is nothingness
after death or whatever. Simply put, If I'm right, I'll be ok, and you
will burn. If you are right, nothing happens to both of us. Why go out
on a limb for nothingness? Jesus offers a free gift, just take it. :D" Pascal's gamble. I know about it. I know that if I choose your way and I am wrong, I have wasted my life. If I choose my way, I get to use this life. I'd rather have a 100% chance at life than... not. Plus, hell wouldn't be so bad. Wait, whetstone would be there...
Korf41"Atheist sites are not expected to give correct information as they have an
agenda and do not have any sort of journalistic integrity, JUST LIKE
CHRISTIAN SITES." Very True Everything Wardav said pwns..
Like someone previously stated you dont go to heaven because you were "saved". I think that if your a Jew, Muslim or w/e and are a good person, you'll find a place in heaven and learn to accept Christianity.
I still have yet to watch the whole thing, but it is very compelling thus far. It's sad to see people 1 and complain about the 7 minutes when they sat through the 11 minutes of the telemarker lady's ranting and raving then 5ed it. What is the world coming to? But plz, if you could, slow down the speed of the pics by at least a few seconds on some parts, the frames go by way too fast.
Infidel carries the same connotation as negro, accurate but offensive. I would also like to thank nickelplease for posting the same damn scare tactic that every last one of you converters shout. It's you people that are afraid of the unknown, not us. Stop trying to pull us into the fearful spiritual slavery of medieval days. Stop presenting a "What if you're wrong" scenario when there is no evidence of your position. And stop posting fallacious religious material on a comedy site.
whetstone: do you forget that you are a GUEST on this site and that Max can do whatever he pleases to any of your sites, mine, or anyone else's? Right off the bat you act like you have some sort of right to have this site. Aesthetically the site is severely lacking and uses blatant, corny psychological effects such as making text red and a black background (POMG HELLFIRE.) Audio is extremely idiotic and gets tiring after the third looping; C-quality horror flicks sound less laughable. Your sources are all heavilly biased and don't represent mainstream scholarly work. Your entire "argument" (if you can even call it that), besides the extremely questionable sources, is a fallacious appeal to fear. If there is any site that ever deserved a 1 it is yours sir.
One thing to add: theology has a pretty in-depth history and there are numerous brilliant theological arguments from theists WHO ACTUALLY DON'T HAVE THEIR HEAD UP THEIR A**. If moronic prosyletizers like you actually read up on their own theology and knew how to reason an argument, then maybe they'd have something to add to discourse.
The Stargate is real.. and the show is a documentary!! if 10 seasons and a spinoff series isnt enough proof then lets see your jesus battle the Replicators or the Ori. I'm sure it'll be much more entertaining than the 7minutes i just lost. Luckily, the comments were of higher quality. on a final note i'll leave you with an Arthur C. Clarke quote "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
I read through two of them, but I didn't really see a point to it all, regardless of the fact that the point would be pretty void, depending on people who lived hundreds of years ago giving their dying breaths to disprove or prove something. Also, it's only quoting books, so I can't really acknowledge that as truth. Also, Voltaire was a dick.
This is so pointless. Also I don't think using fear is going to help you convert people on ytmnd. I can't even take this seriously. You need to lighten up and find a way to believe whatever you want to believe in peace, without pestering those who choose to believe otherwise. And no, I'm not an atheist.
Max DID scold you on such things before, did he not? Whatever, as informative as it may be, we aren't talking about a simple court case; we are talking about human psychology. Do the majority of undrugged athiest, knowing they are about to die, repel their infidelity and go to 'christ'? If not, your case is void.
Four things I love about this YTMND: (1) using the word infidel-- congratulations you basically equated yourself with Islamic extremists in my mind; (2) blatantly lying about the circumstances of Voltaire's death; (3) never referring to any of the other "infidels" by name, and (4) using as your main source a book that is more biased than the Bible. You, good sir, fail with an intensity more often seen in success. I think Voltaire said it best: "I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it."
I have to agree with some people. Its not a very proveable thing. I mean, I mean everyone knows what Hell is supposed to look like so it can be obvious that they may see that image they learned about. Although I'm sure there's more to it, it lacks definate proof. You would have to prove to us that each of these people didn't know what hell looked like or never heard of it before in order to be more influential
Just so you guys know, I talked to Max in PM last time around and he had this to say to me: "|i'm not saying your site doesn't fall under allowable guidelines, you are free to create pretty much anything you like here and i probably wont stop you, but at the same time i have the right to despise you 8)"
...what about the thousands upon thousands of atheists that didn't suffer horrible painful deaths? or the thousands of "perfect" christians who have? also, did you know that when you have near death experiences, or near death itself, your brain releases a drug into your system in high enough doses to cause you to hallucinate? also, if you follow dante's inferno, those who follow "good" lives, and have christian values, but do not believe in god, do not burn in hell, but are rather sent to a level of hell no worse than earth. btw, ever read the new testament? If you had, or had payed attention rather, you probably wouldn't make yourself look so foolish. you look like some witchhunter from medievel days. also sh*tty site. 1'd
"Voltaire was known for his sharp wit, philosophical writings, and defense of civil liberties, including freedom of religion and the right to a fair trial." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltaire Yeah, you're right, Whetstone, what a bad man. You lose. Also :"There is an apocryphal story that this house was purchased by the Geneva Bible Society and used for printing bibles, but this appears to be due to a misunderstanding of the 1849 annual report of the American Bible Society [1]. Voltaire's chateau is now owned and administered by the French Ministry of Culture." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voltaire
There is really no need for the hateful speech and cursing currently being thrown at whetstone.
I can understand reasoned and calm disagreement, but the repeating of "I hate you!" 50 times, and telling him what he can go do with himself only makes us look like children. What is this? Kindergarten?
If you disagree with Whetstone, fine. But don't drown him with hate and violence for he's done nothing worthy of that. It's not like he's worshipping Hitler and calling for the end of the Jews or the blacks. That would be one thing.
I admit that I am a Christian, and I may have not used the infidel title, mainly because the enemies of civilization, Islamic Fundamentalist Terrorists, use it often.
Again, if you disagree with Whetstone fine. Why hate speech?
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